By the hands of the Gods, you have been plucked from your time and from your world, dropped into the box.
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Community Pandora World Shakeup and Brainstorming

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by Rani, Feb 3, 2018.

  1. Siri

    Siri je suis loser
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    I love the idea of theme-correcting locations in broad strokes so medieval fantasy land doesn't turn into tomorrowland over the course of X time. I'm a little concerned about the idea of theme-correcting down to the character-level in places, particularly in large activity hubs, as a mandate.

    Partially for the logistics craziness that might introduce (what about those genres where science is indistinguishable from magic etc etc, do we just pick and choose /squint) and partially for concerns of imposing greater segregation other people have brought up. I feel like no-tech or no-magic zones (as they're being applied to Iron Man suits or Gandalf's Gandalfness) may work better, for the purposes of panfandom interaction, as optional plot devices (like the good ol' Prometheus dust) that players can opt to mess around with instead of a blanket effect for one population center or another?

    Maybe geeenerally speaking the longer tech exists in medieval fantasy land, the greater the chance it has of breaking down? Or the longer a magical enchantment/imbuement exists in tomorrowland, the greater the chance that has of going goof? So players can be given the lore flexibility to decide what happens to characters with essential tech and magic without being boxed away from significant locations?
     
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  2. Nic

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    I really like @Siri 's thoughts! Specifically, I agree that these themes should only have bearing on the environment and not characters themselves. I also really like the idea of technology/magic working for a while in other zones but eventually breaking down. I think this will give people a little more leeway. I definitely see the concern about strict "genre zones" creating IC cliques - the whole point of a panfandom is to mix and match canons and genres. If we keep these themes to the environment and otherwise give characters free rein, I feel like that would be a good middle ground!
     
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  3. Siri

    Siri je suis loser
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    On that thought, I can see science-y characters setting up temporary quick fix tech shops in magic-land and magicky characters setting up quick magic booths in science-land. :p A little sprinkling of each in their opposing genres, but not to the point of overwhelming the environment!
     
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  4. Kitty

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    Out of curiosity, is there a reason that these new genre zones must have solid boundaries?

    By which I mean, why have them divided by barriers that force people to funnel through Pandora Town itself? The portal system being centered in PT makes sense, and anyone who doesn't want to risk the wilds of whatever genre surrounds the town they want to travel to can use them, but is there a reason you don't want characters to be able to cross over at other points along the boundary? Because personally, I think it'd be pretty fun for a character to take a wrong turn and accidentally wind up in Fantasy Land when they were trying to get to a town in the Modern World and suddenly there's a bigass dragon blocking the road or something lol

    Plus, the idea of a border zone where the genres kind of bleed together as you cross from one into the next is really intriguing and could make for some great plot fodder, so I was just wondering why the walls need to be there, if they do ^^
     
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  5. Wisdom

    Wisdom The Crazy Geek

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    The thing is, you can totally even do that now in Pandora. ^.^ If you want a character to get lost and attacked by some beast or find themselves in a situation they wouldn't know what to do, it's not that hard to pull off already. I mean, the characters in Pandora aren't Mary Sues/Gary Stus, so sometimes getting wrong directions will happen. What I've loved about Pandora over any RP site (besides you all, love ya to bits), is that it had a land where you could have two characters, used to their own universes and rules, and put them in any spot in Pandora.

    It also adds more to the lore if we have unique towns. What I love about Pandora is how there's a backstory for everything. Every populated area has a story to go with it instead of "Here's the laws, here's the places, now go thread!" It helps everyone understand what town does what and have everyone invest in the locations emotionally. Not saying the themed places wouldn't be sentimental, but it would feel a bit more, I don't know... I guess 'forced' is the word I am looking for.

    Sci-Fi town at the end of the day will be sci-fi town, where almost every sci-fi character will live, and just not be as fun as people figuring out how to adapt to it with other characters and towns that are more characterized than being labeled as a single theme, you know?
     
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  6. Siri

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    This is why I'm lowkey in favor of preserving the "identity" of the other towns (Cascade Bay, Misty Hollow, Horizon, Morhall). Maybe not their locations or their population sizes (if those are the only attributes that may or may not be up for change!), but there's something kawaii sweet and precious about what characters have put into them thus far- and it'd be nice to see their histories continue past the Great Shakeup of Year ??? even if their surroundings have undergone massive shifts.
     
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  7. Fleet

    Fleet Madness, it's all in the mind!

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    I love many of the ideas being tossed around here and before I begin I just want to thank the staff for continuing to like produce thought raking ideas and things to improve the rp experience, you guys are awesome!

    Now I have 2 thoughts/worries of my own, you mention major changes or complete removal of one of the current towns but I'm not sure I am in favour of that, I feel like we should keep the current layout and expand out or insert things out not remove or destroy what already exists because people have characters and plots happening in those current towns. I think if something major is to happen to one of the other towns those who play characters in those towns should get a say in just how far that goes. If you can come up with a plot where the townspeople escape or whatever alongside the rpers of characters in whichever town you plan on removing then I my point is a little more moot. THough I still would prefer the current towns to remain as they are with maybe events occuring on their borders because of the new changes to Pandora as a whole.

    My second worry is that if we enforce borders dividing these lands where the only through point is PT it feels very restrictive and regimented, making Pandora as a whole actually feel far smaller. I like the thought of more open lands with no actual borders, you can easily slip between them without going through PT... You can still have magical forces within magical lands which effect tech without using borders or something sci fiy which dampens magic in sci fi areas. on top of that as this is a panfandom roleplay surely its all about genre mashups and putting our characters in situations they wouldn't normally be in? Surely a little bit of mashing up of genres on the edges of these locations where the magic of sci fi stuff is weakest is an example of characters in new situations and evolving to improve it?

    I don't know if I'm really making sense, it's 1am here but these are my thoughts for now! I'm not trying to upset anyone and I really love the discussion and debates going on in here... I'm sure with a little more brainstorming you guys will make it all really awesome.
     
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  8. Blix

    Blix Twinkle twinkle, little bat.
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    I don't have a huge lot of pro-active stuff to say because it's late, I just got on, I'm tired and I only just caught up BUT. Speaking as someone who was here the first time we had a Big Shakeup I honestly wasn't sure about the changes before they were implemented because CHANGE IS SCARY.

    BUT. The moment it was all in play I LOVED it because all my charries that were settled had to sort their shit out, there were huge new areas to explore, about a million new potential plots were spawned overnight and some of the most fun I've had on Pandora was with my character adjusting to the new world, exploring it and finding their feet in it and meeting other characters in the same confused boat or meeting those trying to exploit it.

    I love the idea of a big shake-up because I've always been a bit saddened watching really cool-themed areas be 'developed' and that development has just turned them into the same as everywhere else. That kind of pseudo-modern current-tech deal going on where nothing is grimy or bad or low-tech etc. Personally I can't wait to shove a sci-fi character into somewhere they'll whip out their phone and be tried for witchcraft, or force one of my magic-charries into a grimy apocalypse full of zombies and crap that they'll despise. Because it pushes them and me to explore new plots and places I wouldn't have considered before!

    I'm probably also in the minority here but personally I'm not that concerned about the more real world physics aspect of it. I'm not fussed about what the currency will be for each land or the government laws or taxes or anything that applies in my real life (aside from them maybe crumbling into chaos and we have some bids for powers by villains plz and maybe some shitty rules, corrupt governments etc etc for great plot purposes instead of everything being 'nice' and settled - lets let our criminal elements, gangs and villains shine so our heroes actually have someone to fight against). It's Pandora. It's ALWAYS been totally batshit so I say, embrace further fuckery and lets get some badass new plots on for this brave new world!

    My ONLY comment is I liked someone else's thing earlier about not having barrier between the lands because it would be hilarious to be aiming for medieval land, accidentally take a left instead of a right and end up in apocalypse land fending for you life. Aside from that...LOVE IT ALL. Y'all do whatever, I'm seatbelted in and here for the ride. xD​
     
    #28 Blix, Feb 3, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
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  9. Rani

    Rani MODgician
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    Okay, there are a lot of great thoughts here since I've been out all day. Hope I'm hitting all the big ones here, but let me know if I missed anything. :)

    So, Sci-Fi land won't be removing the possibility of magic entirely. It's going to have room for both hard and soft sci-fi, as well as science fantasy, such as Star Wars. It's the same thing with fantasy land. It doesn't mean there can't be any tech at all, but it's more about how much influence tech vs magic has on the overall world. Fantasy-land might have some steampunk style stuff, clockwork gear, but it's not going to have wireless networks or cell phone service or motorized vehicles available in every corner and stuff like that. And for Sci-fi Land, there's plenty of room for magic-type stuff, but magic won't replace technology like it can do in fantasy land. This should give us plenty of flexibility in how to shape the environment and give a lot of variety even within a single region.

    But we won't be policing down to the individual thread what players are doing or how they might be interpreting things. So, there's a lot of leeway there. The only time we might step in is if it starts popping up in Pandora News articles and seems like it would trigger a genre "imbalance" for the region, if that makes sense.

    Correcting of Tech/Magic Levels on the Zone vs Character-Level

    Okay, so after talking about it with the other coordinators, we are not going to be doing any kind of broad magic/tech-corrections on individual characters. While Pandora is about throwing characters into this new world and seeing them adapt, we don't feel it's necessary to strip a character of their abilities (whether magic or tech-based). Plus, I think implementing something like that would make it less likely for characters to travel outside of their home region.

    However, I am 100% on board with setting up interesting anti-tech and anti-magic zones in various places of Pandora and I'll definitely make sure that happens. We won't have these in any of the hub cities for each region, but with the help of the community, I'm sure we can come up with some interesting places worth visiting, even if it will put some characters at a disadvantage.

    Stuff like this would be really cool!

    On Genre Cliques

    So, this is something that I was a little concerned with. But this is actually something that already happens in Pandora, and has happened ever since we first introduced the smaller towns. Sci-fi characters all hang out in the Cosmic Wilderness (or previously Horizon, before space was a thing), and several large fandom groups based on modern and/or horror/supernatural settings all hang out in Misty Hollow.

    While we do realize that this change could exacerbate that issue a bit, I honestly don't think it will grow any more abundant than it is now, since that's entirely based on player choice. And we definitely plan to throw events and such and try and give characters reasons to come out to other regions.

    Other Stuff

    Nope, there's no particular reason. It was just an aesthetic thing when I was first sketching out a map idea. I'm honestly not sold on the idea of these being impassable barriers. But I definitely want some kind of boundary, even if it's just a notable piece of geography, like a mountain range, a river, an evil Cthulhu abyss or whatever.

    Well, we're giving you guys 8 months notice so that you can plan accordingly. If this happens, it won't be until September, so just make sure your plots don't require a certain location in September, and you should be good.

    But one of the towns will definitely be removed, since I have no intention of increasing the total number of main focus communities we have. And there is huuuuge demand for a sci-fi/space thing, so that one will be replacing one of the current smaller towns.

    Pandora won't be auto-killing townspeople when she shifts things around, so no need to worry about that. They might just blink and find themselves in a new place in Pandora. The change will be disruptive, but it won't be automatically lethal to any npcs.
     
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  10. Rani

    Rani MODgician
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    Also, @Blix ninja-posted me, but I love everything you said.

    Those are my same thoughts on Pandora, the current trend of development in Pandora, and a lot of the reason why I want this shakeup. I feel we're loooong overdue for one, and Pandora canonically loves to do this sort of stuff. :p
     
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  11. Lanni

    Lanni Moderator
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    So I love everything here! Shake ups are great in the fact that characters everywhere will be forced to react to them. And I do love torturing my characters I just have a few technical questions to keep in mind through the process, now that I've read the full extent of this new splintered world and such....

    (1) We are talking about certain pieces of technology not working in certain 'worlds'. And certainly: any technology would cease to work over time in these pockets. My question, which would be the question of all ya'll nerds if faced with a technology-less world is.... what happens to the wifi? The Starknet?! Do people who have characters talking all day on starknet status' suddenly have to say 'oh no my character can't post anymore, I live in fantasy land'. Does phone contact cease to exist for some of these characters?

    Of course people are welcome to come up with a solution that means our magic buddies can keep blogging, but it's something to keep in mind when talking about technology disappearing from areas.

    (2) How does magitech figure into the equation? I thought the point was that magitech was a combination of magic and technology? (which if not, ignore this I'm just dumb lol)

    (3) Food production. It sounds like we are completely creating a new world here. And all these areas sound great and beautiful and fun. But um.... if Elysium Field, which has been the communal food maker for all of Pandora in regards to the big communal farm being out there, disappears overnight to make way for lava world well..... all the food just up and disappeared. Kinda alarming to think about. Of course this could fit into the general plot of 'ohmygodwhatarewegoingtodo', OR the communal farm might shift to modern era land, or fantasy world, or idk. Pandora finds a way.

    Speaking on that frame we should totally have a patch of land and call it 'Jurassic World' with dinosaurs in it. That would be awesome.
     
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  12. Rani

    Rani MODgician
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    The availability of internet, cellular service and such will be dependent on the region you're in. It won't be a thing in fantasy-land or apocalypse-land. It can still stick around in sci-fi land, Pandora Town, and modern land.

    So, characters will have to adapt to going without those conveniences if they travel to an area without that sort of technology.

    As for the status updates, those are primarily non-canon, so that won't change. Anybody can still play around with fun status updates. But it just won't be a thing they can actually physically do if they're in certain regions.

    Magitech will likely stick around in Pandora Town. But each region will have its own tech rules, which may or may not have room for that magic and technology fusion.

    Pandora will adjust. We're honestly not too worried on the nitty gritty details of infrastructure or food sources or stuff like that. We're more focused on creating fun environments to play in and explore. Every region will be able to sustain itself from the very start (except apocalypse land, cause that's kind of it's thing).
     
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  13. Chen

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    I feel that I somewhat fall into the line that this feels somewhat....inorganic. Like one of the big things that was interesting and unique about Pandora was that it was super organic and while some towns did have certain defining features. Having such areas capable of easily being changed depending on the character who went there and started what business and got said amount of success, and just easy transport between towns not needing a hub or some sort of special transportation to get around natural or unnatural barriers. And that helped when A trek character could easily live in Misty Hollow and not be inconvenienced due to communications being lost due to magi tech being in play and it feels odd to suddenly just remove an element like magi-tech from Pandora in certain areas to situate a theme of the area. It just....it feels more like a completely different site to my opinion than an expansion and shakeup of what Pandora currently is.

    Having very gene specific areas can have some interesting ideas in them on the short term...on the long term I feel I sit with Fleet where I think the current setting of Pandora feels better and the current towns and locale really allow for more player input and allow the world to change with player input of course with reasonable moderation by staff to avoid too over encompassing world changing events unless it's pre planned. But I feel like it's the freedom that a town could change if an idea could gain enough traction with fellow plotters. And I feel like mixing up Pandora into something....feels less like a natural world where anything and everything can be a part of and more into something like....a theme park world with one city in the center, like that would sorta disrupt that freedom no matter how loosely applied the zones were. Such as in Apocalyptic zone my main like question/concern there is the idea it's meant to be a inhospitable and unappealing as possible as a place to go that it's meant for exiles. Why would a character go to a place that's filled with zombies, super mutants, and super villains, without being forced there via some circumstances or outside party.

    It just feels like there's less organic plotting that could go on there compared to someone wanting their character to head to Cascade Bay to get a different feel than they would in Misty Hollow. And it just feels like the only reason that someone would put a certain character in a certain area would be to inconvenience them, I feel like instead of hard reebooting the world into a completely new one that feels akin to Imagination Land in South Park it would be more in keeping with the player based expansion that Pandora Currently has which I feel is why it has such an active player base, would be to expand upon the current world of Pandora via expansion to the North of the Box and expanding the Cosmic WIlderness we already have.

    Like in the end yes there's an eight month period where plots can still happen but simply having eight months won't make much a difference if all that plotting is all for not when that town vanishes and all progress and tech is lost and any locations are lost in it as well in exchange for a space town that could still exist even without the loss of progress in another town.
     
    #33 Chen, Feb 3, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
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  14. Kingof192

    Kingof192 Guest

    I see opportunity and benefits for story all over the place here. I think story is the piece that can nudge people in the right directions without it feeling forced.

    Most barriers in the real world are political more than physical, often with physical terrain defining where the separated political groups draw the lines. This can be applied to a Pandora by setting up some competition between the regions. In terms of physical resources perhaps, but more importantly in terms of ideas. So there are some laws that are particular to the philosophies on the genre of each reason. If you can set that up, the world would feel bigger, there's incentive for players to gravitate toward their genre's region, as well as the feeling of something special when a character is outside the region they would seem to belong in.

    An apocolyptic world clearly needs a different sort of boundary than other worlds, as well as a reason for people to be interested in going there. I would suggest a resource specific to the region. It might be necessary to have a way for characters to get trapped deep within it, which is a way the atmosphere of something like Walking Dead could be created

    Boundaries can be an interesting place for genres to clash. Some fandoms are a mix of more than one genre after all. Perhaps Fairy Tail is in a place between medieval area and big city area, for example. Or perhaps they are a guild of people that are known to travel between the two.

    Big city region and Pandorra town would need to have some strong distinctives if they are not to feel redundant and interchangeable, especially to the new player. Offhand it feels like one of these would be more peaceful than the other. A place where Mad Men businessmen and Your Lie in April teenagers are more involved in their dramas than having to run away from the Green Goblin.
     
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  15. Andii

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    So I can kind of get where the staff is going with the need to "reset" a few things.

    For example: Pandora Town is large and well set up. It's the main hub of the board but because some of the other towns are unable to draw as much attention, they feel more like after thoughts than anything else. Not many people want big plots in those areas and sometimes they seem really centered towards one set of characters with little draw to others. It's hard to get "big bad guys" or others even, to plot in those areas because the draw of Pandora Town is too strong. It's uneven on the board.

    Personally, and really this is just my 2:30AM opinion so take it with a grain of salt, I feel like some sort of revamp or event to realign the board is a great idea. There just needs to be some balance to it. For example Cascade Bay has really been taking shape and is starting to come into it's own. It may not be PT big, but it's starting to get big enough for it's own plots and it's own life!

    If the board would be reset in this manner I would personally suggest that Cascade Bay and Misty Hollow be mostly left as is but relocated into one of the new regions. I would also suggest regular boarders between most zones with maybe the chaotic area having magical barriers to keep the criminals sort of... in. Instead of prison, everyone gets exiled into that area for x amount of time based on their crimes and maybe the portals are regulated or something by the surviving towns in return or... idk there.

    Morhall and Horizon just... sorry to say (again just a personal opinion), would probably profit from an entire revamp into new towns and/or be left as ruins. It might be that we have too many settlement/towns for the number of characters on the board and as these two have the smallest populations... well, it might help balance the others out into bigger populations that can have a better chance of becoming their own. More people in moved Misty Hollow and Cascade Bay, for example.

    Additionally though I'm really keen on the space settlement. My idea is (in order to help balance the world and PT) to use this new settlement as sort of a bastion? Like what if Pandora created duplicate portals in each new region. One that goes to PT and one that goes to the space settlement. So while PT is still your best bet over land, you can also use the space settlement for traveling purposes if you don't like PT. This would really help to strength that settlement and help it grow into a neutral location that isn't PT but is taken away from all the changes. We have so many "scifi" space characters that a lot of them would likely move here because it feels more like home to them and it's interesting to characters interested in that sort of stuff (i.e. Wolfgang!).

    So really my over all tldr suggestion: Do the patchwork board change. Keep Misty Hollow and Cascade Bay mostly as is but moved locations almost entirely into the new patchwork somehow. Extreme but regular borders between most locations (i.e. steep mountains, endless cliffs, etc). Magical barrier between the crazy criminal section. Duplicate portals that match in PT and the space settlement. Wipe Horizon and Morhall off the map. Takes us from five uneven towns to a more balanced four towns, with options for all different types of characters and plots for the change in dynamics from it all.

    I do like the idea of some "big bad" coming in an rearranging the place through their own schemes, though Pandora just doing stuff makes sense too.
     
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  16. Ophelia

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    It seems that the main issue here is the organic development of the whooole neeew woorld, so I'm thinking.. let's make it so! For instance, i remember that The Governor's plot for an anti supernatural setting was super famous, but due to Pandora Town being tiny as fuck, it had to be contained in one neighbourhood. Now imagine that plot in a whole settlement, wouldn't it be more exciting? I think so! So we could easily just.. let the characters shape the worlds through their plots and that's how any anti places are being formed. After all, as previously mentioned, the cool thing about the towns we have now is that they have a history which was developed by the PEOPLE (someone stop me before i go to one my of usual rants sdfghj) and there's no reason why the same can't happen in this new world, provided there aren't any major changes that would destroy the feeling of it.

    Also, in regards to realistic consequences , like having no food in one area, those can easily be implemented by using common sense and making use of the resources available as it already happens. I am sure the people of Cascade Bay eat a whole lot of fish- that's what they have. Magic land can have its food grown through magic, modern land through Lextech and Waynecorp technological miracles and so on. Some place will have laws because it makes sense IC and some of us enjoy the feeling of a modern world to rp in, others won't and everyone will be happy.

    As for venturing in inhospitable environments, that can still be developed organically. How about a rich character that pays bounty hunters to bring him monsters from the Apocalypse Land for hs collection? Boom, player driven af. And a million of other reasons that people will think of (Andii's crime land place idea is cool af. like Arkham City but bigger OOOOOH YEAAAAAH)

    Lastly, in a larger setting it'd be easier for players to 1. go big with their characters, 2. avoid major plots they don't like or feel comfortable with. We have the luxury of the second because we have 5 towns, but the first is kinda ehhhhh.
     
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  17. Dharke

    Dharke Join me in Coosa!

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    I cautiously like the idea, but feel the same way as Fleet about two points:

    Perhaps as a possible solution you could consider merging two of the towns. Morhall and Horizon seem like the most obvious choice because they're the smallest and similar(ish)... If you squint. (W)horhall? Morizon? Moron? Another suggestion is to allow residents of towns (or perhaps characters with leaders in them) the opportunity to help tweak and shape the new rejigged towns according to what you want from the new environment, which would both reduce staff work, as well as make players who contributed ideas, time and effort into developing their towns in the past feel like it wasn't for nothing.

    Yeah, I would prefer to travel (IC) to the different places without having to go through Pandora Town, because it's already such a big focus on the forum. I'm also not a fan of restricting characters to one location, if you're considering this as an option.

    I wanted to add more comments (particularly positive ones), but I've got to go to work now! I give it 7/10 at the moment.
     
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  18. Nessa

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    Doing this from an IC standpoint would be a really cool idea and it would remove that feeling of inorganicness from the shake up. And, I mean, we also have something that's kiiinda perfect for this already going on? With @Mr. Wednesday and @Media here, and the tension between them, and the whole Old World/New World (Historic Fantasy/Modern World) idea that they represent, a whole "War between the Gods" plot could probably lead pretty easily to this kind of splitting the board up into genre-specific regions? The political/ideological reasons for the borders would be there, it would be a nice, big, juicy plot that could have the sorts of effects that would shake the board up this amount, There'd even be a reason provided for the creation of the apocalyptic wasteland (after all, if Gods are battling in an area it isn't going to look very pretty afterwards...)

    I mean it's just an idea, and it'd totally be up to the characters involved, but i thought it was worth mentioning...>.>
     
    #38 Nessa, Feb 4, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2018
  19. Amity

    Amity Player

    Posts:
    261
    Good afternoon I hope you all are ok today? Anyway I just wanted to mention my thoughts on the subject. Personally I like the idea of Pandora itself being expanded, I am concerned however about it being split to different regions/genres. I mean for example would character need to stay in those regions? What about travel wise? I know that teleports would be used, but it makes posts interesting if they were on the road or in a forest etc. If I have missed seeing these sections then I apologise, I just didn't want my characters to be split up due to them being a family. (Light, Caulfila and Asuna to be added soon) Also is there a possibility of new towns or cities being added to each genre? If so I have a few suggestions.
     
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  20. Nairne

    Nairne Player

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    I'm going to hold off my suggestions/opinions for now as I creep because there's a lot of good ideas here and it's helping me build what I want to say anyway.

    Would the mods/admins be able to draw a quick map of what they were thinking with this change? Whenever I try to think about characters moving locations and what not, I try to reference the map whenever I can when thinking about the layout of the world. I'm a visual person so it helps putting it into perspective of what you're going for :)
     
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